149766-wildstars-hooks-and-why-they-arent-holding-my-attention
Content ---- ---- Did you read the entire post? It's not just my opinion this was a general agreement of me and a few of my military buddies who put a decent chunk of time into Wildstar. As far as what we gained from it, nothing. We aren't looking to "gain" anything, if anything we are just trying to lay out some information (with the idea its an opinion of a select group of individuals who are new and put time in) and why it isn't holding our attention. I get it you love Wildstar good for you, don't be pissed because others have a different view of the game and wish to share it with others. Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- I'm completely not pissed. I'm just trying to figure out, what you want to try to contribute with your and your "military buddies" point of view. Because, I don't get it. All I see is: "This game is bad." It actually has 0 constructiveness. So, well, if you don't like the game, I'd offer you to just leave this game behind and that's it - no need to bother me or those actually enjoying the game, right? Now, if you're trying to make suggestions, just do them. But I don't see any, since you're just pointing out stuff you don't like at all or you just feel wrong, broken, nonsense or whatever else. I don't get why you're frustrated after all: Playing this game is your solely your decision. No one is forcing you. Edited February 20, 2016 by Jeraldan | |} ---- Do you even understand what being "constructive" is? It doesn't have to be a "problem here, solution there" thing. Constructive is based around how you present your views and opinions. If I had the answers or the fixes (like so many wannabe internet subject matter experts nowadays) then I'd be working on the game myself. I'm presenting me and my friends views from the consumer/player side. And get over yourself we are "bothering" you? Thank god Carbine, NCSOFT or any other major company in general doesn't follow your thought process. If you don't think feedback or opinions matter from your consumers then stay out of business. And you're right nobody is forcing me to play which is why at least for the time being and foreseeable future I won't be playing it. Nobody is frustrated stop being a hypocrite you start by saying you're not pissed but then make an assumption about me being frustrated. Just because I made a post on the game forums and gave some insight on why a select group of new players who played and completed a decent chunk of the game and why we wont continue playing doesn't mean we are upset or frustrated. The game isn't in the best of spots, and alot of people ask the question why the game doesn't seem to be doing well with player retention despite it's F2P conversion, so here is OUR view and opinion. So again you love Wildstar good for you, but if you're going to try and paint me in a bad light at least ATTEMPT to make some sense first. Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- Thanks for the salt. I could use also a bit of pepper and vinegar. And of course, lesser whine. Don't forget to turn off the lights once you hit the door. Fare thee well. | |} ---- Translation, "I have nothing to say, no rebuttal so I'm going to resort to 5 year old comebacks (I know you are but what am I?)" Its ok Jeraldan the world doesn't revolve around you though, other people can have opinions and views and they don't necessarily have to line up with yours :) | |} ---- ---- Awesome glad to hear you like it. Yea no doubt as I stated above countless times, Wildstar is definitely a well put together game, some of it's design decisions didn't really hit home for me and yes my military buddies. Take it for what you will but I will continue to say it as much as I'd like to. So before you attempt to characterize or find a "motive" as to why I say things think about how that discredits you as well then. Next time you take a pot shot at my credentials and try saying "if you were in you wouldn't feel the need to say that" type of thing think about how "classy" that is of you. Don't be hypocritical and say don't do this then point out your in too or that you "have the t-shirt" LMAO, otherwise I cant take you seriously. If I'm fishing then I guess I need to hand you a rod (rolls eyes). Anywhos I get that posting an unpopular opinion about a product on its forums (especially MMO's as their forums are basically cancer) was going to be interesting but wow. I disagree with this notion that all the issues with Wildstar that turned people off are resolved, at the end of the day if a product is enticing it will draw in business. My main MMO SWTOR was in a worse rut a year into its launch and going f2p, the doom and gloom was heavy on it as well, but whether you agree or disagree with some of their design decisions, at its core its a competitive, marketable, and enjoyable game. It had flaws in the beginning that were indeed "ironed" out and because of it it's a completely different game. Financially EA has stated multiple times its happy with its earnings report and it's populations are overall super healthy (minus the PVP servers). Is it a perfect game? No no game is but it has successfully "turned the ship around". So there's more going on here with Wildstar than either of us the average consumer with average information knows. Anyways I hope you're right about Steam, but then again the F2P conversion was supposed to make a drastic change in retention and population and as of now little impact seems to have been made. I played WoW for a VERY brief time and didn't like it either, but at the same time I respect Blizzard and WoW and understand that they are still whether people like it or not leading the charge in the MMO genre. WoW is the Call Of Duty of MMO's, its popular to talk trash about it but when the next installment drops people go out and buy it anyways. LIke I said I wish Wildstar well, at the end of the day I'm a gamer so I support games, more competition in any market is overall better for us the consumers. Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- ---- Out of 10 posts is that seriously what we are gonna focus on? LMAO I tend to notice this happens alot on the good ole interwebs. MMO forums are so used to being filled with toxic conversation that when someone attempts to talk rationally about something people have to gravitate to anything I guess. Sure I said military buddies, I guess I have to break down my psyche or personality now this is hilarious. So my personality or I guess more-so the way I tend to talk is hey these are my military buddies, hey these are my classmates, or school buddies (college) etc. I tend to only have a small tight knit group of friends that I just call friends, anybody else I tend to classify as "the type" of buddy they are to me. Whether you agree with how I type or talk is up to you but I type how I talk. LMAO one thing I'll give Wildstar is their forum posters are either super conflict oriented or need a hug one of the two. Yes I said military buddies ohhhh boy. :) Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- ---- ---- That's you're experiences as there are plenty of people who refer to a specfic person and refer where they know them from. Nobody said my job meant something here but keep making new accounts this is hilarious LMAO Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- To be fair, it may just be that those are the ones you specifically notice for one reason or another. Nobody tends to bat an eye when "classmates/room mates/BF/GF/cousin/etc." is mentioned. | |} ---- I honestly didn't read other people's replies, and I'm replying to your post, not theirs. But wow, you seem very defensive for some reason. I'm just curious about the significance as you repeatedly mention it; because I'm a simpleton and would just refer to them as "friends from work". | |} ---- ---- It was like this from the start. Any criticism was met with open hostility. Threads like this were flooded with shitposting to close them. "Lalalalala i can't hear you", "Go hardcore, or gtfo" was a main staple of a "core" audience, and game tanked pretty bad. Game still have massive glaring design (from questing to UI) and technical (game crashing with new DX12 videocards, poor performance) problems. F2P was supposed to a revival, yet we haven't seen particularly good numbers, and with new content months away, things not looking good. PR is a nightmare. Everyone's thinking that Steam and China release will be some magical comeback. It wont. I don't regret playing game, i don't regret leveling multiple characters to 50. I had my fair amount of enjoyment and frustration. Too little, too late. | |} ---- Most service members find it tacky. Edited February 20, 2016 by Scatter Gun | |} ---- ---- Aside from the miletary buddies discussion; I've read through these walls of text, and I cannot agree to points listed. Sure it's your opinion, but trying to generalise your issues with the game is something not acceptable. Many people playing the game; are actually playing it because of the unique combat system. Asking around it's usually one of the very first argument given for Wildstar as to why it is different and what makes it fun to play. Especially in dungeons and raids where everything evolves around the objctives and mchanics created through the combat system. Population Problems. Yes, we are a small community. But being "turned off" by a small community is exactly the problem. How do wou expect a community to grow if everyone has that kind of mentality. Or is there a magic button we can press somewhere to conjure up millions of players? Problems with queues? Join a guild or circle; problem solved. How can you even have queue issues with this? You have a full party right there. | |} ---- It is called "feedback", that's what usually all companies want from customers, you know. | |} ---- I completely agree with you that companies want feedback from customers. I think the difference for me personally is when I go out to a restaurant or clothes shopping, I don't have to read or listen to everyone's positive and negative experiences. Maybe someone can illuminate for me why general discussion forums are the feedback area for customers of an MMO? Can there be a specific feedback forum, or thread designated for feedback? I'm not trying to dissuade people from feedback, I just wonder why feedback notes aren't pinned to the walls everywhere in my favorite brick and mortar store, while they are in the forums of MMO's. | |} ---- ---- ---- Hey! Maybe he is trying to say that game is not hardcore, that even military folk can play it? | |} ---- Nobody is saying that at all. (shakes head) like I said earlier in this thread, I get that MMO forum users are used to seeing toxic conversation so when someone attempts to post anything rationally they have to gravitate to something I guess. Out of 26 posts you guys are really gonna latch onto the fact that I said "military buddies" when referring to me and some friends who played the game ignoring everything else? Like I said So my personality or I guess more-so the way I talk are "hey these are my military buddies" "hey these are my classmates or school buddies" (college) etc. I tend to only have a small tight knit group of friends that I just call friends, anybody else I tend to classify as "the type" of buddy they are to me. Again whether you agree or disagree with how I talk or type just understand that I type how I talk. So continuing to latch on to this one aspect of the thread is pretty pointless. You don't like how I type or talk, and I'm not about to change it for you as that's who I am. Now that is cleared up, if you guys have anything to say regarding the actual post I'm all ears. I stated in the thread initially and will say it again. I won't pretend what I've said is fact nor have I presented it in any way as such. I understand its an opinion of myself and yes a few of my "military buddies" who played together and got through a decent chunk of Wildstar's content. People have posed the question, why has the F2P conversion not done a better job of player retention or growth. While I don't presume to have a factual concrete answer to that I at the very least can share our views and opinions based on our experiences so far. :) | |} ---- Actually, that might be true just for the US, because on Jabbit the server and it's <50 LVL-Zones are getting pretty filled, specially the starter zones. I just got to recruit 10 new folks for our guild. I mean, yay. And about the categorization of your buddies. Just say buddies. No cares about if they're your college-, school- or army-buddies. They're just your buddies, period. And again: Why are you even keeping up the discussion, if your buddies and you aren't going to keep playing WildStar? You made your point quite clear. Edited February 20, 2016 by Jeraldan | |} ---- ---- All fair points, OMG a legitimate post are you sure you're part of the Wildstar forum community? Lol yea completely understandable, What I have noticed the further into this thread it has gone is that individuals who see a rational post about things they don't necessarily agree with, yet they have nothing meaningful to contribute so they resort to "heh you said military buddy, heh". Not sure if you have any type of military background yourself but either way glad to see you at least see things from both sides of the fence, and quite frankly both things are legitimate. You have "less than desirables" in all professions and walks of life the military is not exempt either. As far as the population portion, it's a fair point, I was more explaining from our perspectives what we encountered in our experience with Wildstar as a whole. What I have noticed is individuals who are at endgame and are in these "established" guilds or groups that run content are kinda in their own bubble in a way. In some circumstances I've seen those individuals claim the population isn't as big of an issue as it is simply because they have no issue grouping up for content etc. So the point of that section was just to highlight the issues that a group of new individuals were having when all of us weren't online to group up and run together and giving multiple examples. So captain obvious for some not so much for others. Yea I'd agree that us as gamers or just individuals in society as a whole should be more cognisant of what we say or how we present ideas and views. On the contrary I feel that I was very respectful while not "sugar coating" things either. A few individuals have stated things that I simply don't agree with. I still refuse this notion that Wildstar has completely resolved all the woes and issues that people had with the game at launch. At the end of the day an enticing product will sell itself. There are numerous game franchises (MMO's included) that have bounced back from bad publicity or launches, while others do not. I think the way Carbine has set up the Wildstar F2P model itself, it causes an issue with incentivizing a subscription. All of us while playing subscribed but quickly asked ourselves why we did as our game experience changed to a minimal degree. They have made design decisions for Wildstar that I feel like the majority of the MMO playerbase isn't a fan of. Some have disputed our take on WIldstar's combat, if you enjoy it, again I'm honestly super glad you do, but I feel like you're in the minority. Most of the successful MMO's on the market today have stuck with the traditional tab-targetting 2-3 skill bar combat system we have come to know in MMO's. Gamer's don't know what they want, "hardcore MMO gamers" quickly realized in the masses that wasn't what they wanted. I believe we are starting to see the same with MMO combat. Outside of Blade and Soul (which is still fairly new) there isn't many MMO's doing well outside of the traditional combat system. Edited February 20, 2016 by MightyMouse019 | |} ---- Just because folks disagree with you or have a different opinion doesn't mean that they have nothing meaningful to contribute. As for the seemingly inescapable military thing in this thread and I apologize if I'm mistaken; I'm just getting a sense of the seal team cook syndrome. What ever the case, thank you for services rendered but the conversation would have been less awkward if ya hadn't included the DD214 (that's satirical BTW). Just friends or buddies would have easily made your point. Edited February 20, 2016 by Scatter Gun | |} ---- ---- /hug | |} ---- Wow, he's also paranoid. Here we go. | |} ---- Paranoid? No not at all I just refuse to believe that the majority of Wildstar forum posters have the attention span of a 5 year old. You see an entire post, not written in poor taste outlining a particular perspective you don't agree with yet have no meaningful contribution to, so you latch onto anything you can to discredit them. Which as funny seeing as its an opinion/perspective, like I said before if you're going to try and paint me in a bad light at least ATTEMPT to make some coherent sense. You see what you want to see, which is why you focus on one portion of this entire thread, which is also why you quote a single portion of an entire post like you did. | |} ---- as someone who bought 2 copies of the deluxe edition at launch and started playing again cause apparently my female friends cant get enough of the humor and art style of wildstar,reading the responses to the OP all i'm thinking is damn no wonder people leave the game and never come back. I actually agree with several things the OP said which is why i left,as others have said constructive feedback is pretty essential for devs regardless if other players think it's a load of crap or not. here's to hoping the entire community isn't this way for a game that is clearly struggling to find it's stride. Edited February 20, 2016 by Pantaro | |} ---- ---- ---- ---- In all actuality very few service and prior service members play their enlistment or commission like some sort of crown of laurels. But every zoo has a few knuckle draggers and window lickers. | |} ---- Perhaps I should have reworded it; Why does it seem likes it's only people in the military who have to announce their profession? | |} ---- I have an answer. Most don't have to. Even when they do it. Sure, there will always be some that "need to" but most of those that do isn't because they feel a need to display it. It is simply because they are speaking genuinely from a basic reality of their lives. The same way "civilians" might mention their sister/brother/BF/GF/co-worker/classmate. No one assumes someone is bragging that they go to school or has a job. No one thinks twice about it. But for some reason, people assume that if someone mentions they are in the military, it must be because they are trying to put it in lights. edit: another possibility is that those who need to put it in lights are the ones who never joined the military so it still seems super special to them. "Stolen valor". "military" would be the generalized version. Like going to school or work. You know the ones that need you to know when they get real detailed in their descriptions. Edited February 21, 2016 by Bytek | |} ---- Had he simply said "my friends", I wouldn't have thought twice about it. But instead he needlessly added "from the military" which is no different than saying that they are friends from any other job. There's a difference from calling them your co-workers, or class mates, than actually disclosing what it is that he/she knows them from needlessly. If someone said; "my friends from college", I would feel the same. Why is that necessary to tell us OTHER than to gloat about it? Whether or not that is the intent, it is easy to get that impression. He could have simply said "my friends", or "my co-workers". There was no reason to add the "from the military" part. I dont see "military" as being that generalized, considering it IS a job. If you dont need to say what industry you work in, then why is the military excluded? Edited February 21, 2016 by Mental Surge | |} ---- "Classmate" already implies "friend from school". There is simply no single word in regular use that encompasses "friend from the military". Any that could be used would still be seen as an announcement because it would still provide military info. And, there is really no need to hide the reality of the life he lives. So, he may no be tuned in to specifically not saying it. The military is a whole other world. It can become regular habit to specify which friends. Now, if he was getting real descriptive with his branch of service and job within the branch and where he is stationed, that's when you give him a "/pat on the back" because he obviously needs it. :P This would actually be the answer to the question. (those that aren't engaged in stolen valor). That because it is a whole other world, it can be a habit to specify which world your referring to. So, if you were in the military, you would hear "friends from highscool" or "civilian friend". Edited February 21, 2016 by Bytek | |} ---- Thank goodness someone gets it. The bad thing is you have people like Scatter Gun that make posts and go on about how they are dropping it or are "over it" yet they feel the need to continue to try to paint you in a bad light or that your "seeking recognition" yet he himself right afterwards decided to say he "had the T-shirt and served as well". Just drop the whole "heroic, justified service-member act" nobody in their right mind is gonna listen to someone in the same sentence doing something he is complaining about. I'd honestly like to think that most people on the interwebs in general can think for themselves. A simple browse through the posts would show you that 2-3 individuals are beating this "military buddy" drum (one of which being hypocritical and letting us know he was in right after trying to "give me a talking"), and nothing I said was specific in job, title, location, rank etc. If someone really wanted to "announce" themselves (and you can use this same example in any career field or status for that matter) I'd like to think most are smart enough to know that more icing on this "seeking recognition" cake are needed than just a basic "military buddy" reference. If you went to college and got a masters, if you make a ridiculous annual income, if your a professional sports star or celebrity, and were "seeking recognition" they would tend to give more details than that. I get that most haven't served but I refuse this idea that you can't even attempt to think about this logically. We are seriously 46 posts into this thread on a video game forum I might add and the 1 steadfast thing that people want to latch onto (again thanks to the same 2-3 individuals that are dead-set on trying to drive this pointless topic home), is attempting to dissect and infer my use or motive on "military buddy". Guess I should feel special? Lol like I said before the way I tend to speak would be "hey this is my school/college buddy" "hey this is my military buddy" etc, I only have a select group of close friends that I would just call "friends" anyone else I tend to classify as the specific "type of buddy" they are to me. If you don't agree with how I talk then that's your opinion but I type how I talk. And bear with me here but as crazy as this sounds I'm not the only one saying this here, the majority of people here are saying similar things, its the 2-3 individuals still beating this drum. The bigger thing that people need to realize before they infer or make their own decisions, is why are these select group of people attaching themselves to this pointless debate (which boils down to them trying to dissect or determine MY use of "military buddy")? Because they are trying to either de-rail the thread/post itself since it doesn't match their perspectives and they can't offer any type of meaningful contribution, they want to discredit me the poster (which is hilarious seeing as this thread is based on opinions and views), or both. For all intents and purposes let's just entertain this idea that I'm "seeking recognition", does that in anyway change the topic or reasoning behind what this post was about? You guys are smart use your own deductions. | |} ---- Hey, we're just sharing our opinion about you in reaction to your opinions about the game. Everyone is free to have his opinion about anything and anyone - which doesn't means, that you or any other has to accept that opinion, right? Well, that's how the world works, good man. But let's get into it a bit deeper: This game has one of the best and strongest end-game contents available currently between all MMOs. If you think that's not the case, be that good to point out any other game having a better one, besides World of Warcraft. Always try to keep a certain objectivity when going to rate, because when it comes down to tastes, everyone's right. The majority of folks on Jabbit are currently reporting a noticeable raising in population numbers, with queues popping up faster and even at non-regular times. This goes not only for Raids, but also for BGs. We've seen the earnings report for 2015. We've seen, that the earnings for Q4 have raised. As long as we don't see those for Q1 2016, there's no point in speculating if it goes up or down, so the trend has to be assumed to keep raising until the contrary has been proven. Sharing feedback is your own, personal point of view, which clearly stays against the point of view of others. It doesn't really matters you're speaking for your friends. Yet, the most stuff you've been pointing out was already known and nothing new. Usually, people are asked to use the forums search in order to make sure not duplicating threads with the same content. And let's go down to the military thingy once again. I've served myself, been twice in Afghanistan and once in Iraq. Got a graze shot which ruptured my Carotis Interna, leading to 3.9 L blood loss. I've been always proud serving to my country, yet I wasn't ever one of those seeing himself in a "special position". No, I wasn't one of those having to wear their uniform even in their free time. And no, I wasn't one of those having to brag around with my job in order to gain any kind of acceptance between those who know me. And no, I never said "military buddies" or "comrades" when talking to folks, no matter if they were my family or people I don't know - they've been always my colleagues, friends or buddies. We even had an adage to tag folks acting that way: "Army brags" or "AAW's a.k.a. Army Attention Whores". People, that have basically nothing else in their lifes, that they've to refer to the army even when they're sitting alone on the John. Not even talking about how they behave having a date. That being said, you came up with YOUR OPINION. And yes, you're free to share your opinion - which DOES NOT mean, that anyone else has to SHARE your opinion. That's how free speech works, Sir. Everything else is called indoctrination - and most folks spreading it, are usually ignorant and selfish. And finally, a little word on tastes. There's a guy, called A. He goes to a Restaurant. Guy A realizes after a short period of time, that he doesn't likes the Restaurant after all, but he keeps staying there. Yet, instead of just leaving it in order to find a better one, he feels like he has to tell everyone his POV about how and why he doesn't likes the Restaurant. For others being in that Restaurant, it feels like someone is pathetically forcing to form the opinion of them - which makes them feel bad and annoyed. Well, Sir, let me tell you one thing: There's something known as TARGET AUDIENCE. That's why people refer to rainbows in terms of colours. Everyone has his own tastes - and if he doesn't likes something, he better gets to look for something he - in fact - DOES like. So please, be that Guy A, who realizes that he didn't like the Restaurant - and just leave it in order to find a better one. Or at LEAST, be constructive. s(^.~)-b Edited February 21, 2016 by Jeraldan | |} ---- ---- They aren't. I've seen others. I know in these forums I've seen quite a few people mention their job, especially if they've got a background in computer programming, gaming, or even customer service, depending on what the discussion was and they were wanting to add weight to their opinion or give out their expertise on a matter. Maybe biases or presumptions of your own makes you notice one group doing it over the others that do it. Edited February 21, 2016 by beattlebilly | |} ---- Pretty much this. They don't like what you said and they're looking for a way to offend you enough to make you start raging or go away. You haven't taken the bait, so congratulations on that. As for your opinions, thanks for sharing them. Edited February 21, 2016 by yasfan | |} ---- ---- ----